Clarification regarding fixation of Pay of re-employed ex-servicemen pensioners retiring before attaining age of 55 years and who hold post below commissioned officer rank in the Defense Forces.
Department of Personnel & Training
Establishment (Pay-II)
Reference preceding notes
D/o Posts may please refer to their proposal on preceding page seeking clarification regarding fixation of pay of re-employed/ex-servicemen pensioners retiring before attaining the age of 55 years, who held posts below commissioned officer rank in the Defence Forces and also whether the last pay drawn before retirement is subject to protection.
2. The. matter has been examined in this Department. It is pointed out that paras 4(a), 4(b)(i) and 4(d)(i) of DOS (Fixation of Pay of Re-employed Pensioners) Orders, 1986 as amended vide this Department’s OM. No.3/19/2009-Estt.(Pay.ll) dated 5.4.2010, provide that in case of ex-servicemen
who held post below Commissioned Officer rank in the Defence Forces and in the case of civilians who held posts below Group ‘A’ posts at the time of their retirement before 55 years of age, the entire pension and pension equivalent of retirement benefits shall be ignored, that is, no deduction on this count is to be made from the initial pay fixed on re-employment. Also, in terms Of the Para flin) of CCS (Fixation of Pay of Re-employed Pensioners) Orders, 1986, as amended vide this Department’s O.M. No.3/19/2009-Estt.(Pay.ll) dated 5.4.2010, the initial pay on re-employment shall be fixed as per the entry pay in the revised pay structure of the re-employed post applicable in the case of direct recruits appointed on or after 1.1 .2006. as notified vide Section II, Part A of First Schedule to CCS(Revised Pay) Rules, 2008. These instructions do not provide for protection of last pay drawn before retirement, in such cases.
3. Deputy Secretary (Pay) has seen.
sd/-
(Pushpender Kumar)
Under Secretary (Pay)
D/o Posts [ADG (Estt.)], Dak Bhawan, New Delhi
DoPT ID Note No. 1101965/2015-Estt.(Pay-II) dated 28th August 2015
Forwarding letter by Deptt. of Posts:-
FILE NO. 01-01/2011-PAP
GOVERNMENT OF INDIA
MINISTRY OF COMMUNICATIONS AND IT.
DEPARTMENT OF POST S(ESTABLISHMENT DIVISION)
DAK BHAWAN, SANSAD MARG,NEW DELHI-110001.
THE: 15th September, 2015.
TO
All Chief Postmasters General,
Chief General Managers, PLI, BD&MD,
Deputy Director General (PAF), Postal Dte.,
All General Managers(Finance),
All Directors of Accounts (Postal),
The Director Postal Staff College of India, Ghaziabad,
All Directors of PTCs.
Sub: Clarification regarding fixation of Pay of re-employed ex-servicemen pensioners retiring before attaining age of 55 years and who hold post below commissioned officer rank in the Defense Forces.
Sir/Madam,
I am directed to forward herewith a copy of clarification issued by the Ministry of Personnel, PG and Pensions, Department of Personnel and Training, New Delhi, DoPT ID Note No. 1101965/2015-Estt.(Pay-II) dated 28th August 2015 on the subject cited above, for kind information and further necessary action at your end.
2. Clarification may be circulated to all sub-ordinate offices concerned, with direction to dispose all cases of pay fixation of re-employed ex-servicemen pensioners retiring before, attaining age of 55 years and who hold post below commissioned officer rank in the Defense Forces, in light of clarification issued.
Enclosed: As above
Yours faithfully,
sd/-
(Major S.N. Dave)
Assistant Director General(Estt.)
http://www.indiapost.gov.in/dop/pdfbind.ashx?id=1612
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COMMENTS
Hi all, I have a question to those Ex service friends who joined in central govt department. Is police verification/antecedence verification is required for Ex service men also before joining again in govt service??
Respected sir
I maan singh retired from Army on 30 June 2010 and join central govt in Delhi police. Please tell me what is the rule of re-employed for promotion and pay fixation. I join with grade pay 2000 and when I retired my grade pay is 2800 I give a application to fix my pay from my last when I retire from Army are it is possible if yes so provide me a OM issued by DoPT. And please tell me what is the rule for promotion for reemployed ex-servisemen.
Thanking you
Maan Singh
Mob No 9968767953
My dear friends did any one moved to court or met any lawyer for this rule. i think we should make a solid effort for challenging the same in court.
can anyone help me getting order copy notifying the revised amount of "IGNORED PENSION" (Rs 4000/ I presume !!) on Reemployed of officers (Commissioned officer)
if there was no pay fixation w.r.t to last drawn pay by PBOR..then why the hell does 1986 O.M mentions what constitutes last drawn pay for PBORs of Army, Navy and AF
I retired from IAF as sergeant on 30 Sep 2010 and joined central govt as Auditor through SSC. Presently working as Sr Auditor with GP 4200/-, but did not get any pay protection otherwise Basic would have been more than what I am drawing now. My pay started at the minimum of the pay scale of the new post, as I received full pensionary benefit and the same was ignored. Any comment pl.
Am going to leave military service and my last pay will be of 2800 grade pay. If am going to join a central government job of UDC of Rs. 2400 grade pay. Then my last pay drawn of Rs. 45000 gross will be protected or not? Can I get more than my last pay drawn or only the general salary of UDC only?
FIRSTLY WE ARE ASKING FOR THE REVISION PAY FIXATION NOT PAY PROTECTION & WHO ARE ALL RE EMPLOYED EX-SERVICEMEN BEFORE ATTAINING THE AGE OF 55 YEARS, ELIGIBLE TO CLAIM. THE EVIDENCE IS CLEAR, ONLY WRONG INTERPRETATION & SOME SORT OF FEAR IN DECISION MAKING BY DIFFERENT AUTHORITIES.
My dear friends
Pay fixation after re employment is applicable to all..pbor or officers.If you go thru the OM it is very clearly state that "no protection of scale of pay" which means if an officer joining as clerk, his earlier scale will not be protected,but his basic pay will be fixed at last drawn stage including grade pay of clerical grade..ie, he will not get the scale protection, but he wil get the pay fixation at last drawn basic.this is what is called entry pay .There are a lot of confusions created by some of retired officer cadre itself as they still think that pbor are their slaves..that is why they are saying pbor are enjoying with handsome payment..in banking sector there is no different scale in clerical cadre as in the case of central govt.so they fix the payment at higher stage as last drawn basic pay…but confusion arised when somebody misinterpreted the definition of basic pay..so it is clear that you will not get pay scale protection..but you are eligible for pay fixation to the last basic..if you are deprived of the benefit go to court
para 3 (2) (ix) of 1986 OM relating to pre retirement pay of (JCO,NCO and OR) for fixation of pay and DOPT letter 8/11/2010 clarifies that MSP should be added in pre-retirment pay while fixing the pay of re-employed ex-servicemen. what for the word pre-retirment pay used in 1986 OM.
Keshav Bhat ji your views are very clear on fixation but we have to raise this issue at higher level.
Neither playing with the terms used in the rulins nor war of words will not serve any purpose. But DOP&T very well provide under para 2(1) of their OM DTD 11.11.08 that the initial pay of a reemployed govt servant who is deemed to have elected to be governed by revised pay scale Wef 1.1.2006 and whose pension were ignored to be fixed according to Rule 7 of CCS RP Rules 2008. This OM has constitution approval. So question of fixing pay as per rule 8 I.e. minimum of the reemployed post does not arises. Para 3(v) of DOP&T OM DTD 5.4.10 very well clarifies that those personnel who joined Dept on or after 1.1.2006, their pay has to be fixed at the same stage of last pay drawn before retirement from military service. So there us no ambiguity anywhere. DOP&T says only that pay protection is not applicable, it do not says that initial pay cannot be fixes at the same stage of pay last drawn. So if govt gives some benefit means it has some meaning. If some anonymously say that those who recently join service(reemployed person) gets more than his senior in the Dept has no meaning. Because to get an exserviceman status it is not so easy as one think. If one practically served in defence forces, then only he can understand why the govt has given the privileges to ex servicemen.
I retired in 1999 from the post of hav clerk from the Indian Army at the age of 36 and re-employed in haryana govt. as a teacher in december 2004. My pay fixed was the same as of a fresh civil candidates (i.e lowest) at the time of employment and hence didn't get any benefits.Please provide me with the information of any new notification/declaration regarding any upgrade in the same by central or haryana govt.. Attach any copy if possible.
You retd a clerk, 4 years later reemployed as teacher after further education. you didn't qualify
Dear Friends,
The concept of pay-re fixation is totally ambiguous as a veteran retired but joined a PSB little later is less paid from a veteran joined immediate joined after retirement. Pay protection or re-fixation should be as uniform as the qualifying service . i.e. if a person joining a PSB after 20 yrs of military service , to protect the pay by giving the benefit of the military service the pay should be re-fixed at par with a clerk of the PSB with the same length of service at that particular time or the last pay drawn by the veteran – whichever is higher. This will bring an end to the huge disparity between the payments of ex-servicemen joining in PSBs. I am Sgt S K Mishra Veteran , retired from IAF on 31 Jan 2012 after 20 yrs and joined Andhra Bank on 27 July 2015. My basic re-fixed at 20095/- where as my colleague retired on Jan 2015 has been re-fixed at 28000/- , a direct difference of 8000/- on basic and around 15000/- on gross salary. This is happening due to ambiguous policy on pay-refixation.
We as veterans has to unite and fight for an uniformed pay structure for all .
Individually the case of pay fixation at bank can not be solved due to following reason. First, Bank is autonomous in their HR. Second, there is no pay protection provided to ex servicemen re-employed in central government. Though the bank is doing pay fixation but it is following the guide lines issued by DOPT which is very confusing. Further DOPT guide lines only give leverage to short service commissioned officer otherwise its guidelines ensured that basic pay and basic pension received by PBOR and permanent commissioned officer on re employment should be lower or exactly at par with basic pay drawn at the time of discharge from military service. Third, For pay fixation, Banks follow the guidelines of IBA, IBA follow the guidelines of DOPT so DOPT does not have guidelines which deals with pay fixation of PBOR. Fourth, Now question can be raised why bank is doing pay fixation to PBOR since long back? Here is the reason. As I said DOPT guide lines are very confusing and in confusion pay protection is given to PBOR at bank since long back. Further, in past years, the initial term of engagement for PBOR was 9 years and giving pay protection will not lead to surrender of DA as after 9 years PBOR not entitled for pension so there was no much loss. PBOR in IAF become Sergeant after completion of 8 years of service in IAF. It means sergeant have sufficient knowledge and experience of an organization. The knowledge and experience of PBOR was recognized by bank and they continue to giving pay protection to PBOR.
IAF increase the term of engagement from 9 years to 15 years and further to 20 years. Thus PBOR were bond to serve the IAF till completion of bond. In this way, We see that IAF mold the service conditions to use knowledge and experience of PBOR for smooth functioning of organization and to achieve reduction in work and responsibilities of officers. But guidelines issued by DOPT remains same as these guidelines take care of ex-servicemen who served the armed forces for 9 years. This can be very well verified while you apply for re-employment. In advertisement you will find it under definition of ex-servicemen. This definition says that whether you serve say for 5 or 10 or 15 or 20 years, you are an ex-servicemen and entitled for ex-servicemen reservation for group C and D post and age relaxation. In this way, PBOR faces double damage to his career. First stagnation in IAF resulting loss of pay and status in IAF second there is no career in civil job after putting 20 years service in IAF. Because your age is more resulting tough competition with young people rapidly changing technology and education. Though knowledge and experience gained in IAF is more than sufficient but PBOR lags in educational knowledge because this was acquired though distance learning mode which leads to weakness in theoretical aspect.
In view of the above you will find that career of PBOR not protected taking into consideration the changing service condition of IAF and changing civil environment. Therefore most of the PBOR are suffering in terms of pay and status. PBOR problems can not be solved by individually. There is a need of a platform to resolve the issue pertaining to PBOR by presenting comprehensive details before appropriate authority.
What is the latest policy of pay fixation for commissioned Army officers who retire before attaining the age of 55 yrs
Only commissioned officer can enjoy pay protection but never seen that officer is is joining clerical in bank . ur da on pension will be ceased and 4000 from pension will be deducted and ur last pay of army will be protected but not more than a GM in bank.
I Just to know whether widows of defence civilian are also eligible for CSD facility as at present they are not entertaining the applications for same or how much time to wait for this facility
Dear Sir/Madam,
Whosoever is responsible for pay Protection should go through this post as I have sufficient evidence that the people who have retired from the same organization and working again as a civilian in the same organization have already got their pay protection. In our case we find it very difficult to get our pay protected. We all have our fundamental rights I mean to say how there can be a bias/discrimination/disparity/deficiency in the same law. I got a reply from [email protected] which was a complete copy paste .i.e the person copied the complete content and pasted and sent the e-mail without understanding what is said in the e-mail. How obnoxious and unprofessional. I expect some one to go through this comment/post and give me a valid reason as to how others are getting and I am left at ground zero where I began. Writing this comment also takes time and patience. I wish some one responsible could write me a valid reason and not a copy paste comment on my email which is waste of time for both. There is a mechanism for every thing in India. I am looking for a reply for this discrimination.
Dear friends
The DOPT letter applicable for pay fixation( not pay protection. OK) as on date is as follows:-
(1)O.M. No. 3/1/85-Estt. (Pay II) dated 31st July, 1986
(2) read with O.M. No. 3/13/2008-Estt. (Pay II) dated 11th November, 2008 and
(3) O.M. No. 3/19/2010-Estt. (Pay II) dated 5th April, 2010
Now as per above orders neither you are only eligible for minimum scale of pay of post re-employed nor the Last Pay drawn. Hope you all understood it means no minimum pay or Pay protection. Please give attention to the terminology used as pay protection.
Please refer para 3(V) of the OM dated 05 Apr 2015. This clarified as you are eligible for only to the last basic pay drawn (not last pat drawn). Now question is what is the last basic pay. Therefore further please refer Para 3, sub Para 2(ix) of OM dated 31 Jul 1986 & OM dated 5 April 2010 [note under Para 4(a) for Grade pay & 3(iii) for MSP] to know exactly what is eligible for on re-employment entry pay. Otherwise very simply your basic pension(at the time of retirement) x 2 times + GCB pay. Inthis regard Bangalore CAT has already came out with decision vide OA 1093/2013, 1276/2013 & 1483/2013 to 1490/2013 in favour of para 3(V) of OM 05 Apr 2010 for Railway employed ESM. Because the notionally arrived last basic pay has been mentioned in the OM is for pre 1.1.2006 retiree who re-employed after 1.1.2006, because to bring parity with pre & post 1.1.2006 retiree who takes re-employment on or after 1.1.2006. This is the purpose of the para. The bank fixation/protection does not applicable to the personnel who come under the purview of the Pay commission.
Also it is not yet followed in CG departments so suitably take up the case after studying all the details and rule position. Onething I want to clarify to you all is these mentioned letters are issued by the Govt. to give some benefits to the ESM on re-employment.
Indian banking service is great who made a lot of confusion IBA issued the guidelines which are not for PBOR but banks implemented it for PBOR, Now no one is coming forward to rectify it,minimum pay if ur pentionery is not withdrawn is the correct formula.ur pay is fixed correctly.
Dear Sir/Madam,
With greatest reverence I would like to bring to your notice that I completed my term of engagement in yr 2007. I worked in private organization for a period of 6 and a half year and then began working Once again in central Government organization from the year 2013 now my pay is fixed at the lowest level. I have following points for discussion .i.e
a) We have many counterparts whose salaries have been fixed as per the last pay drawn from Central Government organization.
b) We are also said lot of time that you since have worked in the same organization have ample amount of experience, so there is a lot expected from us as compared to our counterparts even senior than us. this is a known fact that a senior is getting more salary than a junior However we promise to give the best as compared to others.
Please help as to how there can be a) bias/discrimination/disparity in the same organization. I have ample amount of evidence to prove my words.
I hope a valid answer to my discussion and not copy or paste as it is done in my last email which I have received by user name Vidya1967. My humble request the reply which I have received is completely out of discussion as in my email I have clearly mentioned that how there can be bias/discrimination/disparity within the same organization.
Thanking you
Yours Truly
Aditya
31 Dec 15
Dear Sir,i have discharged from IAF in Feb 2005 and reemployed in SBI in jan 2009. i have been drawing less pay than my junior counterpart esx ser discharged after 1st jan 2006 and joined banks.How the injustice could be redressed i am in position of my LCP notionally arrived figure as per 6th pay commission recommendations.we have been running puller to post to get our due natural justice.can nay body hear and help us.thanks, with rgds.
Dear Vidya
Don,t misguide the PBOR. Pay protection is for everybody who shift his service within govt. Sectors. Whether it is central o state.
Dear Aditya..
First of all please understand that banks and PSUs have their own pay structure and pay fixation guidelines which a Central Govt employee cannot compalin.
With respect to your query, it is clarified that pay protection is only granted for commissioned officers since fifth CPC where it is presumed that the pay on re-employed post may be lesser than the pay what the Officer has last drawn. There is no pay protection for PBORs on re-employment since fifth Central Pay commission.
Your pay will only be fixed at lowest of the scale to which you have re-joined with full protection of pension with applicable DA.
Hope this will clarify the sjubject
PAY FIXATION IS NOT A NEW THING IT IS GIVEN SINCE 1919 TO BOTH PBORS AND OFFICERS .ANONYMOUS PL READ FIN MIN OM DTD 1958 AND SUBSEQUENT OMS OF FIN MINISTRY. VARIOUS COURT DECISIONS ALSO HAVE VERIFIED THE PAY FIXATION TO EX SERVICEMEN TO LAST PAY DRAWN IGNORING THEIR PENSION AND PEG FULLY. KINDLY GO THROUGH THE HON SC DICISION DTD 1996 BETWEEN DG POST AND B RAVINDRAN. THE SAID DECISION CLARIFIES WHY THE PAY FIXATION IS TO BE GIVEN TO EX SERVICEMEN. IN GOVT JOBS WHO HAS COURAGE TO RETIRE AT THE AGE OF 35 TO 40 YRS AND COME BACK TO INITIAL PAY.KINDLY RETHINK AND READ THE DECISION.DOPT CLARIFICATION WRONG AND THE QUESTION ASKED BY DG POST IS ALSO OUT OF CONTEXT.THIS OM DOES NOT PROVIDE PAY FIXATION BUT THE CONCEPT OF HARDSHIP WHICH IS DEFINED IN HON SC DECISION AND MIN OF FINANCE IS THE REASON WHY THIS IS GIVEN TO EX SERVICEMEN. ANONYMOUS GIVE EVERYTHING TO POLITICIANS THEY ARE REQUIRED MORE FOR THIS COUNTRY THEN EX SERVICEMEN. THANKS
im not against the pay protection/fixation of PBOR but funda is very clear why the senior should draw less pay than his junior only number of inrement ie advance inrement should be granted as per the legth of service then DA will be admissible other wise no body knows what IBA is saying , what Banks are doing, Role of DOPT
I Worked for Indian Air Force for a period of 20 Yrs and completed my initial term of engagement in 2007. retired with the rank of Sergeant now working for indian defence Forces as a civilian my salary is fixed as a new incumbent my Query is can my salary be fixed on the basis of LPC Last Pay certificate
a) I have sufficient evidence to prove that other incumbent are getting where there are several people who are not getting
b) Why one person is getting and another person is deprived from his right of pay protection.
Kindly acknowledge. an early action for this will be solicited
Yours Truly
Aditya
Kindly refer the Orders of 25-11-1958 available in the website of ministry of finance dept of expenditure which says that if your pay on re-employment in the central civil service is less than the last pay drawn you are facing undue hardship.To relieve the undue hardship and maintain the standard oflife in civil the gap of pay is to be filled up.i.e.civil pay plus pension(P.E.G)whether to be ignored or not is lees than the military service pay last drawn you are eligible for advance increments equivalent to no. of years in ex-service.Then it should not exceed the last pay drawn.i.e.equivalent to last pay drawn in ex-service.If the corresponding pay scale does not match then the pay should be fixed below the the amount so computed.Supreme court judgement dated 08-11-1996 given clarification to Dept. of Posts.The case of B.RAVINDRAN AND ANR.OR u can file an Original Application in the Central Administrative Tribunal under CAT Rules 1985 through advocate.
dear jagdish ji thanks for sharing such a wonderful judgement
However i have approached to DOPT on phone today and asked whether my pay will be protected or not
on this she reverted me to para 4 b(i)
In all cases where the
pension is fully ignored, the initial pay on
re-employment shall be fixed as per entry
pay in the revised pay structure of the reemployed
post applicable in the case of
direct recruits appointed on or after
1.1.2006 as notified vide Section II, Part A
of First Schedule to CCS (RP) Rules, 2008.
and told that your pay will not be fixed at the last pay drawn by you
and the new entry pay scale will be 9300-34800 plus GP 4200 nothing else
please guide if you have any idea how to move ahead
BHUWAN BHAI PLEASE GO THROUGH THE RAJSTHAN HIGH COURT DECISION Rajasthan High Court
Union Of India (Uoi) And Ors. vs Mool Singh And Anr. on 7 December, 2001
Equivalent citations: 2002 (4) WLN 603
Author: R Balia
Bench: R Balia, O Bishnoi
JUDGMENT Mr. R. Balia, J.
EVERY THING WILL BE CLEAR IF YOU READ IT ,THE COURT HAS EXPLAINED PARA 4B1 IS FOR GENERAL COURSE OF RE EMPLOYMENT BUT NOT FOR PBORS LESS THAN 55 YRS OF AGE.PARA 4B2 IS APPLICABLE AND 4D1.
pbor not authrised for pay protection IBA guidelines are not for PBOR in para 2.1 (i) NPA is allowance which is only for commisioned officer of medical branch next para (ii) mentioned the officer which every one knows only the commisioned officer. only bans misinterptated the guidelines and given a hand some money to exserviceman ie PBOR enjoy it.
Is ex servicemen from technical trade with diploma certificate & having 20 years experience are given degree certificate also. They employed In bank but X group pay not protected so they must be permitted to apply for technical license to carry out licensed holder activities like :
Electric installation survey, etc. BEE also allowed energy auditor. etc. Did banks permit? Or give NPAlike medical officers.
Sir the pay structure of bank is quite different from central government offices which includes pay band, grade pay, HRA , TPT and retirement benifit on theses elements,While this not the case with pay structure of bank and other PSUs. Since there was no clear guidelines for fixation of ex servicemen pay on reemployment in banks, IBA in jan 2014 in consultation with DOPT/ Ministry of Finance made the uniform guidelines for pay fixation of ex servicemen employed in banks. Further the definition of revised pay structure clarifed by DOPT letter dated 05 apr 10 and as per VI pay commission is combination of pay band and attached grade pay with it, which is not the case with PSUs/banks pay structure.Thus the concept of pay fixation on the basis of last pay elements exists in Banks/PSUs. Thus the recent letter by DOPT regarding pay fixation of ex servicemen in Dept of Post should not be confused/ mixed with pay fixation in banks/PSUs. While i have written this on the basis of various letter issued by Dopt, IBA and other concerned authorites like CDA and discussion with other and senior. It is also true that a clear clarfication on this subject required to be made by Dopt and other concerned authorities with examples of pay element so that a clarity on the above subject may be given to every one concerned.
other sector mean banking sector where IBA is only responsible now the ball is with IBA how it implement this order.their order made such confusion even the bankers are drawing military service pay and junior are drawing 10000/- basic monthly pay from their senior counter part. sub staff is drawing more pay than clerical cader and calerical cader is drawing more pay than officer cader every thing is possible in india now every body will run to the court funda is very clear taking money is very easy but giving the same is difficult those implemented the wrong order the should be penilised recovery may be effected in any way save india.
don,t worry recovery will be effected shortly save public money.
Dear Mr. Join Military service and be posted to a place at Minus temp. Do night duty regularly. Then only you will understand why some privileges are given to ex-serviceman by GOI
Very simple yet another discrimination by DOPT and cheating the re-employed ex-serviceman. Pls Go through the DOPT OM para 3(v) of 05 Apr 2010. Its double standard will understand. Then why other sectors are enjoying? Are those ex-servicemen are not from India. How only few are being exempted.
My case is not solved from 3-6-1980 even after applied in the CAT.Now it is put up before the labour commissioner and rejoinder filed at Chennai regional labour commissioner.The directorate of telecommunication replied that 'LEADING TELEGRAPHIST' in the NAVY is not equivalent to Telephone Operator in Civil although the DOPT Dept of labour Directory of civil tradesequivalent to civil is clearly states that LTEL is equivalent to T.O.